Episode Transcript
Speaker 0 00:00:01 Welcome to the Hand in Hand Parent Club podcast. I'm Emily Murray, a hand in hand instructor and a mom of two.
Speaker 1 00:00:06 I'm Kathy Gordon, a single adoptive mom of a now young adult son, a hand in hand instructor, and we are both moderators of hand-in-hand, awesome membership program, the parent club. Every
Speaker 0 00:00:17 Week we'll be answering a parenting question. You'll hear about hand in hand, parenting's, powerful respectful parenting tools. We'll share how they help you work with your child's feelings, especially when their behavior gets harder, confusing.
Speaker 1 00:00:29 You can feel good about using these tools. They've brought warmth and connection to our own families and to many thousands of families around the world who are using the hand in hand approach.
Speaker 0 00:00:39 That's why hand in hand and the Parent club exist. We're here to support you and your family so you have more good, sweet, fun times together.
Speaker 0 00:00:52 Welcome everyone. Last episode, we answered a listener question about how the hand in hand tool of stay listening changes as kids get older and how we recognize and respond to tween and teen tantrums. And so Kathy and I thought it would be fun to give the other side of the story to that listener question, which is, um, the other tools change too. So this week we're focusing on connection and the tools of special time and play listening in particular. And so we brought in special guest, um, Kirsten Adelson is a big fan of playing and wrestling as a way for us to connect throughout our entire lifetime. And as a mom of a 23 and 17 year old and has been learning from them about play their whole lives. And we as hand in hand instructors have been the beneficiaries of Kirsten's learning as well cuz she shares with us.
Speaker 0 00:01:46 Um, and Kirsten also teaches a starter class, um, just for parents of tweens and teens. And if you're interested in that, you can find more about that on the hand in hand website, um, events for parents. Um, so wonderful, warm welcome Kirsten. Thank you so much for being here with us. And, um, let's jump right in and maybe you can tell us a little bit from your perspective and your experience, how do we know what tweens and teens need from us? Because sometimes it feels like they don't even wanna be in the same house with us, or maybe even not on the same planet with us. Um, so it's, it's hard to know what what they need or want.
Speaker 3 00:02:30 Yes, yes, it is. Yeah. It, and it's really easy as for parents to feel like they wanna give up. And I think one of the things I like to tell parents of teens is like to remember that our, your tween your teen is, is a member of a group of people who, in our society, it is completely acceptable to make derogatory comments about. So you hear people like rolling their eyes when they say teenagers and Oh gosh, I have a teenager. And you know, they can say that to teenagers around teenagers about teenagers. And they're kind of hearing that and feeling that all the time. And we have, you know, many adults out there who sort of treat teenagers as if they're like scared of them or worried about them or just, you know, like, just, you know, there's not a whole lot of warm, relaxed trust.
Speaker 3 00:03:29 Wow. Look what a wonderful human being and how intelligent you are. That's getting aimed at our teens. And so it's no wonder that they kind of come home to us and we get sort of the, ugh, get away from me. Ugh, I'm not interested. Ugh, stop talking. Ugh, you're breathing on me. You know, like whatever it is that you're hearing from your teen tween, you, you are not alone. And, um, it is, um, a behavior that we need to decode. It's, it's not the true nature of who they are and it's not likely what they're really meaning or wanting from us. So we really have to some, like somewhere inside, just remember, like, hear me saying it, hear Emily saying it like they do really want you. And it's just a little bit harder to tell. They don't come jumping at us with lots of glee and say, play with me.
Speaker 3 00:04:18 Play with me. Pay attention. Pay attention. You know, there was lots of time when they did that when they were younger with a lot of adults who said, not right now, I don't have time, not right now. I don't have time. And so it, it's, it's kind of like, you know, one of the things that's happening right now is it's kind of squeaking out the other side. Um, and, and and also what you hear a lot of is, you know, experts say they need their space, give them space. They're trying to be independent and it is true that they need time to think for themself and they need time downtime. But what they need is to be trusted and to be, you know, for you to remember that you actually are significant in their life still. And they do still want us to show that we care and they want our attention, they want our connection.
Speaker 3 00:05:04 They don't want it or need it any less. They're just much less likely to ask for it in the words or the actions that we used to see. And so we really need to sort of, we have a tool called play Listening and Hand in Hand Parenting is all about listening. And when we're listening, it's not just with our ears, but it's with our eyes and our hearts and we're tuning in to try to be able to tell what are the signals my child is sending me? And some of what you can be looking at to figure that out is what I call connection makers and breakers. So if your child comes into the kitchen and starts telling you a story about their friends at school and you say, oh, but first before you tell me that, can you tell me how's your homework going?
Speaker 3 00:05:51 How'd you do on that test? And they shut down and walk out of the kitchen. That's a good example of a connection breaker. If we are nagging at them, if we're, you know, sort of like having a tone with them if we're missing the boat when they're trying to connect. Like just, just be thinking about does that make a connection or does it break a connection? And we really wanna go for more of the connection makers and those might be little playful ways. And, um, special time, which is another hand in hand tool that is about, you know, devoting unde, devoted time, letting your child know, I'm gonna spend time just with you. We're gonna have the next 10 minutes, 15, 20 minutes. And when they were younger they might have gobbled up that opportunity. But at this age, cuz of a lot of the sort of discouragement and ugh, that's so baby-ish, I'm not a baby anymore. They may turn you away, but it doesn't mean they don't want it, it just means they won it in a different way. And I think Emily, you're gonna tell a little story about,
Speaker 0 00:06:58 Yeah, I, um, my oldest pretty early on. Um, I don't know it when I would offer special time in that kind of official, like, you've got me, I'm here. Um, kind of way that used to be. <laugh> used to be a little more appreciated. Um, all of a sudden, um, I don't know, it's like they would just kind of, I don't know, squirm away from it. It was a, it was not something that they, they wanted to sign on for. I think it was part of that like, Ooh, that's baby-ish, or, oh, that's, that's a little intense. Like, I don't, I don't think I wanna sign up for a hundred percent of your attention right now. That's a little much. What, what are you gonna do with it? So I found that, um, scheduling and, um, asking if they wanted to go on coffee dates.
Speaker 0 00:07:49 Um, they are a, a tea drinker. And so I would do an invitation and say, let's, let's go get, let's go to the coffee shop. And so for them it's just a coffee shop time. They get their favorite tea and we sit for a bit, we comment about the tea or the coffee or the jo or the space. Um, but when I go, I have my special time reign on. I switch gears into you have a hundred percent of me. I am not here with an agenda. I am not here, Tory, I am not here to ask questions. I'm not here to, um, give you tips or advice or mm-hmm <affirmative>, uh, or even initiate any conversation that that that might be looking for that. I just am there to follow their lead delight in them and just genuinely enjoy our time together. And that's my whole, that's my agenda. Enjoy time and delight in them. Um, so sometimes I initiate it, sometimes they do. Um, I look for those opportunities to say yes to the activities they initiate with me. Um, and they tend to be kind of small moments these days. Um, is that what you find too?
Speaker 3 00:09:06 A absolutely. And I think it's so good to remember that those little moments of connection add up. You know, whether that's them standing in front of the refrigerator and you instead of just saying, Hey, close the fridge <laugh>, you go to them and like hip check 'em out of the way and say, Hmm, what's good in here? You know, and you're going for connection, you know, that little moment. Instead, they're so used to hearing you say, close your refrigerator, it's wasting electricity for you to go over both them outta the way with your hip. Is is that that little moment where you can have a little smile or, you know, the other day I was with my son who was sick at the doctor and he was just kind of grouchy and thorny and, you know, he didn't feel good. And I sat next to him in the waiting room.
Speaker 3 00:09:51 He didn't wanna talk, but I just reached over and said, Hey, can I reach your palm? And I, there was something I used to do when he was little where I would like pretend to be reading his fortune and I took his hand and just, you know, and he, I just felt, he didn't smile. He didn't say, thank you mom, I really appreciate you playing with me. But I felt his body just sort of like, relax into it. He just sort of drooped against my shoulder. And that's where we have to really be kind of noticing and paying attention and looking for those like tiny little windows of slivers of time when we can put in something that'll, you know, just bring a little sparkle to their eye or a little giggle or something that, you know, you, you, you observe, you're being the experimenter, you're trying things out. Some it's g you know, nine out of 10 of these things might fall on their face, but your persistence actually matters to them. They can tell that you're caring and they really need a lot, they still really need that. Even though they look so accomplished and you know, self-sufficient and that they don't need us anymore, they're gonna, you know, like, do you not need anybody to show you warmth anymore? You're a grown parent, you're a grown adult, but still it makes such a difference when people do those small things. It's true for them too.
Speaker 0 00:11:11 I wonder, um, you brought up the, uh, one of the tricky things about being the parent of an older child is that dance of do they need me right now or don't they, do they want me right now? Or don't they, their words are saying go away, but <laugh> what are they really, um, meaning here? So do you, um, do you have some examples of what it really looks like, um, to kind of find those non-verbal signals? Um, any examples of things you've seen that kind of tell you the real story, not just the words?
Speaker 3 00:11:47 I absolutely do. So I have, um, a situation where I'm recently divorced this year. We're trying to figure out what it's like and how we do this. You know, my son is living one week with me, one with one week with my ex. And I mean, talk about a connection breaker. We're we're separated for a week. And oftentimes when he comes back, he'll, he'll just be in a funk and disconnected and he'll say, Hey mom, and I just wanna be alone for a little while. And, you know, we'll hear our kids say that and the the societal norm says, leave them alone. Give them some space. And I do wanna be respectful of his space, but I can also notice that he, the disconnect is where I can see he can't meet my eyes. He's not saying, Hey, you know what I'd like to do?
Speaker 3 00:12:32 I'd like to be in my room for a little while and then I'll come back out and join you. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>, it's sort of this tight, rigid, uh, like can't look at me, can't, you know, he's just feeling the funk. And the other way that I can notice is he goes into this room, plunks himself on the bed, but he left his door wide open. I think it's such a great analogy. Mm. It's like, you know, like, go away from me but don't really, and so I'm just trying, I don't wanna invade a space, but I also don't wanna leave him stuck in the place where he feels isolated. And so I'm trying something, I'm experimenting. So I sort of like go in and I knock on the door and he doesn't say come in, but he doesn't say go away. Mm. Okay. So then I go into his room and I go over to him and I stretch and yon, I remember a game I used to play with him on the couch, which was like the lumpy bumpy couch.
Speaker 3 00:13:28 And I would sit on the, sit on him on the couch and I couldn't understand why the couch was so lumpy and I would stretching you on. Oh boy, I'm so tired. And I just kind of like lay across his legs on his bed and oh, this is such a comfy bed except it's so lumpy. Ugh. And he's saying to me, mom, get away. However, he's not pushing me off of him. He's not kicking me off of him. He's, he's saying get away, but he's not really seeming to me like he actually wants me to leave. Mm. I think there's that persistence where, you know, it, it's tricky. I don't have an exact formula for how you should do this or what's gonna quote unquote work every time you're just trying things. So I just stayed and, you know, kind of like lumpy, bumpy, beded him a little bit more.
Speaker 3 00:14:17 Ooh. Oh. And now it's talking to me. And, and sure enough, after, you know, a few seconds or minutes of this, like if not really him pushing me off, but saying mom, and then I start to see like the corner of his mouth turn out and he's giggling and he's just, you can feel him sort of like receiving me, wanting me and he loves back rub. So then it turns into a back rub and you know, it's like, it's not easy, it's not a simple process cuz I could have blown it and he could, you know, but that's,
Speaker 0 00:14:51 There would probably be many blow at moments of <laugh>.
Speaker 3 00:14:55 Say it again.
Speaker 0 00:14:56 Many blow at moments of experiments. We try many blow at moments. They fail <laugh>. And
Speaker 3 00:15:01 I wanna say even the moments that we blow, it's like, I think our children get the picture of us having intention. They really do. They're somewhere in there. Even if they're mad at us, they can tell my parent is going for me. They're trying for me. They're not letting me float off into space here.
Speaker 0 00:15:20 Yeah. Yes. I feel like that's been a trust thing of, of mine as well. That my, my intention of I actually do like you. Yeah, I like you and I think you're interesting and I, I wanna, I wanna be available for you. Yeah. I feel like if I can just keep that signal going, um, yes. Then my door is open at least <laugh> and I can sometimes get through their door too. Um, yes. Well we usually, um, like to wrap up our podcast with one small thing that parents can try and experiment with. And I wonder if, um, you wanna leave us with, with one suggestion for folks?
Speaker 3 00:16:05 Yes, I do. Um, so I'm thinking about how easy it is for like, okay, we heard this podcast about play. Okay, I'm gonna go in there and I'm gonna tackle my child and we're gonna get, you know, I'm gonna get the pool noodles and we're gonna play. And those might be all great things, but I think there's a step before that and that's the part about observing and being able to listen. So my suggestion, a challenge for the parents out there is to just for like one week or four days, just notice the connection makers with the little things that you do that create a connection where your child stays a little bit longer, talks a little bit more, or you know, doesn't huff off to their room or you know, is a little bit more willing to stay longer at the dinner table or just something that you do that allows, allows for a little bit more connection.
Speaker 3 00:16:58 They sit closer to you, um, or don't shove you off when you sit close to them. <laugh>, what are those little things? And then what are the breakers? And, and see what you can do to not go from making massive changes, but just observe. Notice slow down enough to be able to tell when are the doors open, when are they closed? Um, cuz they're not gonna necessarily signal it with a wide open, Hey mom, come sit down at the kitchen table. I'm ready to talk to you about my work my school week. You know, it, it's not gonna so nice. You know, so look for those things, just try to do that one little thing.
Speaker 0 00:17:38 Thanks so much and thanks everyone for being with us, uh, on this episode and we look forward to seeing you next time. Take care all. Thank you so much for tuning into the Hand In Hand Parent Club podcast. Please like and subscribe to hear more and to connect with us between these episodes. Come on over to hand in hand parenting.org to join the parent club where you can get coaching classes and live support.
Speaker 1 00:18:02 Come join our vibrant community of parents in the parent club who are committed to getting the support they need to be the parents they wanna become. We'd be honored to support you too. This podcast and the Parent Club are part of Hand in Hand Parenting, a nonprofit organization that supports parents all over the world. We are here for you when parenting gets hard.
